tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post5928027041807454945..comments2024-02-05T10:41:31.777-05:00Comments on I Saw Lightning Fall: The Rain Falls Mostly On the UnjustLoren Eatonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12488412683340389286noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-14438334734829687872008-09-24T09:16:00.000-04:002008-09-24T09:16:00.000-04:00In case you were wondering, I intended the previou...In case you were wondering, I intended the previous comment as a compliment.<BR/><BR/>Genre discussion are fun, especially in the minutiae. All you have to do is read noir -- Manchette, for example -- to tell that it's a different bird than hardboiled.Loren Eatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12488412683340389286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-85464439935500993922008-09-23T14:56:00.000-04:002008-09-23T14:56:00.000-04:00Thanks, I think. Noir seems to be a more contentio...Thanks, I think. <BR/><BR/>Noir seems to be a more contentious term than hard-boiled, but perhaps that's because discussions of noir's definition seem to use hard-boiled fiction as their starting point. Noir, people will say, is more than just hard-boiled.<BR/>==============<BR/> Detectives Beyond Borders<BR/>"Because Murder Is More Fun Away From Home"<BR/> <A HREF="http://www.detectivesbeyondborders.blogspot.com/" REL="nofollow">http://www.detectivesbeyondborders.blogspot.com/</A>Peter Rozovskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09977933481463759162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-35498044308625932082008-09-23T13:46:00.000-04:002008-09-23T13:46:00.000-04:00Peter, I think you'd be the best-qualified person ...Peter, I think you'd be the best-qualified person I know to face down such an assailant ...Loren Eatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12488412683340389286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-12280344305277280922008-09-23T11:47:00.000-04:002008-09-23T11:47:00.000-04:00Which may be a way of saying that it has more, not...Which may be a way of saying that it has more, not less cachet, than some genres because the term carries such strong associations.Peter Rozovskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09977933481463759162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-69354599180301168812008-09-23T11:46:00.000-04:002008-09-23T11:46:00.000-04:00If I were asked, with a gun to my head, to define ...If I were asked, with a gun to my head, to define hard-boiled, no Nile or Amazon of sweat would rn down my forehead. I'd just reply, "Oh, you know." That's hard-boiled: We all know it when we see it, but it's hard to define. ==============<BR/> Detectives Beyond Borders<BR/>"Because Murder Is More Fun Away From Home"<BR/> <A HREF="http://www.detectivesbeyondborders.blogspot.com/" REL="nofollow">http://www.detectivesbeyondborders.blogspot.com/</A>Peter Rozovskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09977933481463759162noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-68368745217512150192008-09-17T08:45:00.000-04:002008-09-17T08:45:00.000-04:00Interesting. I've never really followed Whedon, al...Interesting. I've never really followed Whedon, although I did watch an episode or two of <I>Firefly</I> years ago and enjoyed it.<BR/><BR/>If you like that "visual and moral style" of noir, you might enjoy Abel Ferrara's <I><A HREF="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112288/" REL="nofollow">The Addiction</A></I>. Warnings are that it's uber-arty and shot mostly with hand-held digital cameras. It's also more-than-a-little gory, although the black-and-white moderates that a little.Loren Eatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12488412683340389286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-63459303444026911242008-09-16T22:36:00.000-04:002008-09-16T22:36:00.000-04:00Probably not.My friends trend towards an eccentric...Probably not.<BR/><BR/>My friends trend towards an eccentric nook of the "Christian nerd" designation that knows an awfully large amount about all things old and all things genre-fiction.<BR/><BR/>At the same time, I think that the *name* (whether "noir" or "hard-boiled;" I find it hard to differentiate the two) has far less cultural cache than the visual and moral style.<BR/><BR/>(By visual and moral style I mean a story told in high-contrast black-and-white, with characters who almost without exception inhabit a gray moral liminality. The good guys do bad things, the "bad guys" are folks like us gone understandably wrong--but the existence, and effects, of evil is writ in bold and unmistakable letters across the city. And generally also worked into its fundamental power-structures.<BR/><BR/>Visually, we can tell that because light and darkness, illumination and shadow fill the screen.)<BR/><BR/>Taking that into consideration, probably the guy most popularizing hard-boiled fiction is Joss Whedon. Everything he does is enormously hybrid, but by his own admission his natural film-making place is noir.Chestertonian Ramblerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01550643992523840950noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-26974468386551100272008-09-16T19:01:00.000-04:002008-09-16T19:01:00.000-04:00I'll grant Sin City. (Is it bad that I forgot abou...I'll grant <I>Sin City</I>. (Is it bad that I forgot about it?) But most people to whom I mention the genre give me a blank look -- even if they're diehard Frank Miller fans. Am I off-base to think that it has a much-more tenuous cultural foothold?Loren Eatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12488412683340389286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-19388341817657147892008-09-16T18:02:00.000-04:002008-09-16T18:02:00.000-04:00Your introductory paragraph is making me question ...Your introductory paragraph is making me question my grip on reality--between hyper-hard-boiled films like Sin City and mock hard-boiled like Shoot 'Em Up, I never really thought hard-boiled to be all that undiscovered a genre.Chestertonian Ramblerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01550643992523840950noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4025264318423694875.post-70357994476007331242008-09-16T16:47:00.000-04:002008-09-16T16:47:00.000-04:00For those of you interested in learning more about...For those of you interested in learning more about Andrew Klavan, he has a lengthy, five-part video interview at National Review Online, the first part of which can be found <A HREF="http://tv.nationalreview.com/uncommonknowledge/post/?q=N2JkMTFmYjUxMzg1YTJkYzkxMmM0YmZiOTA2YTFhMjM=" REL="nofollow">here</A>.<BR/><BR/>(Hat Tip: <A HREF="http://hunterbaker.wordpress.com/" REL="nofollow">Hunter Baker</A>)Loren Eatonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12488412683340389286noreply@blogger.com